tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post7828893504433980301..comments2024-03-19T03:14:04.172-04:00Comments on Rabett Run: Paul Krugman on WGIIIEliRabetthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07957002964638398767noreply@blogger.comBlogger43125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-54444835971674864362014-04-21T20:56:16.163-04:002014-04-21T20:56:16.163-04:00The Indus valley has seen an assortment of civiliz...The Indus valley has seen an assortment of civilizations, from Harappans to Huns, erased by water crises- hydraulic despotism has its limits , and if there isn't a drought or a flood, every know and again an earthquake will send a Himalaya or two crashing down into the valley way up North, shutting off the river for a year or three.THE CLIMATE WARShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02578106673226403151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-32739434849927912162014-04-21T14:11:43.918-04:002014-04-21T14:11:43.918-04:00"But also the monsoons widening?"
Widen..."But also the monsoons widening?"<br /><br />Widening? I have no idea. Changing? Absolutely. Pakistan's crop failures (which I alluded to) extended to 3 years in a row. 2 due to flood. 1 due to drought. (What is Pakistani for "Pick a lane"?) <br /><br />The menace due to temp and precipitation swings isn't confined to years of terrible catastrophe, but extends to the inability of farmers to plan for the future. Agriculture is the most conservative of industries because the most important input into the farmer's planning is the hope that this year will be like last year.<br /><br />Our refuge so far, with +7 billion inhabitants, is how widespread agriculture is. A simultaneous failure of Russian and Australian agriculture wasn't as damaging as a simultaneous failure of American and Canadian crops. But we've only had .9C of warming. And it should be noted that one afternoon of record heat a couple of years ago killed corn in the field in Kansas.Jeffrey Davishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17966839006518642902noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-33728992717687647372014-04-21T01:56:26.152-04:002014-04-21T01:56:26.152-04:00"But I cannot abide the false ascription that..."<i>But I cannot abide the false ascription that CO2 and warmth are problems.</i>"<br /><br />Spoken like a true winner of a Darwin Award, even as his brain is exitting his arse through the agency of the experiment he swore was completely safe.Bernard J.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-91223757865655105212014-04-20T22:45:30.998-04:002014-04-20T22:45:30.998-04:00Kinda speculative, but that's how one protects...Kinda speculative, but that's how one protects delusions - don't expose them to falsifiable claims.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-90471421527246249662014-04-20T22:43:36.199-04:002014-04-20T22:43:36.199-04:00But also the monsoons widening?But also the monsoons widening?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-20091586062433265682014-04-20T20:57:55.769-04:002014-04-20T20:57:55.769-04:00Ancient cultures making sacrifices to the gods wer...<i>Ancient cultures making sacrifices to the gods were pretty convinced they were preventing disasters that had natural origins too.</i><br /><br />Has Anonymous <a href="http://vvattsupwiththat.blogspot.com/2014/04/it-sounds-better-in-original-tamarian.html" rel="nofollow">been watching <i>Star Trek</i> with Watts again ?</a>THE CLIMATE WARShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02578106673226403151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-42396596156720411022014-04-20T20:19:13.546-04:002014-04-20T20:19:13.546-04:00Anon.
And what about precipitation?
You'd ha...Anon.<br /><br /><i>And what about precipitation?</i><br /><br />You'd have to ask the Hadley cells. They are expected to widen as the troposphere warms. This shunts the established mid-latitude precipitation polewards.<br /><br />* * *<br /><br />Zhou et al. (2011) Recent trends of the tropical hydrological cycle inferred from Global Precipitation Climatology Project and International Satellite Cloud Climatology Project data <br /><br />http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2010JD015197/abstract<br /><br />Which supports J&F09 on widening Hadley cells:<br /><br />Johanson & Fu (2009) Hadley Cell Widening: Model Simulations versus Observations<br /><br />http://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/abs/10.1175/2008JCLI2620.1<br /><br />See also NOAA (Seidel et al. 2007 – Fu was a co-author):<br /><br />http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2007/20071203_tropicalbelt.html<br /><br /><br />BBDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10687930416706386215noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-75515876393292452232014-04-20T16:47:27.257-04:002014-04-20T16:47:27.257-04:00"One of which is the rate of evaporation from..."One of which is the rate of evaporation from the soil. "<br /><br />And what about precipitation?<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-52494440926150294182014-04-20T14:19:58.896-04:002014-04-20T14:19:58.896-04:00"No, more like a portrait of the IPCC Summary..."No, more like a portrait of the IPCC Summary Committee <br />descending on Brussels."<br /><br />Isn't that A Rene in Spain?<br /><br />(Too tortured?)Jeffrey Davishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17966839006518642902noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-13903856768272586642014-04-20T14:17:23.850-04:002014-04-20T14:17:23.850-04:00"Davis, how can you distinguish a drought toa..."Davis, how can you distinguish a drought toady from the ones that have occurred in the past? Why do you believe they have anything to do with global temperature?"<br /><br />Mous, I have no idea what you mean by "distinguish". The issue is a question of difference but of likelihood. <br /><br />An increase in temperature increases all kinds of things. One of which is the rate of evaporation from the soil. Jeffrey Davishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17966839006518642902noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-66818435310581529302014-04-20T13:54:03.645-04:002014-04-20T13:54:03.645-04:00> distinguish a drought toady
> from the one...> distinguish a drought toady<br />> from the ones that have <br />> occurred in the past? <br /><br />Today's drought toadies are trying to sell fossil fuels.<br /><br />Yesteryear's drought toadies were selling dryland real estate by claiming that "rain follows the plow."Hank Robertshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07521410755553979665noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-49016310306552811442014-04-20T13:07:05.867-04:002014-04-20T13:07:05.867-04:00Davis, how can you distinguish a drought toady fro...Davis, how can you distinguish a drought toady from the ones that have occurred in the past? Why do you believe they have anything to do with global temperature?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-68107142496420704492014-04-20T12:50:49.423-04:002014-04-20T12:50:49.423-04:00Davis - can you name an era, century or even decad...Davis - can you name an era, century or even decade in which there wasn't a drought somewhere?<br /><br />Why do you believe a warmer world means more drought?<br /><br />It was surely not global temperature which gave us the 'Dust Bowl' - what did?<br /><br />Ancient cultures making sacrifices to the gods were pretty convinced they were preventing disasters that had natural origins too.<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-61659640309522476452014-04-20T12:44:54.273-04:002014-04-20T12:44:54.273-04:00Badger is correct,
problems of unsustainability t...Badger is correct,<br /><br />problems of unsustainability tend not to sustain.<br /><br />I'm thinking the hysterical delusions about catastrophe and warming are also unsustainable.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-63192500665107433312014-04-20T12:41:53.874-04:002014-04-20T12:41:53.874-04:00"The link clearly shows the developed world&#..."The link clearly shows the developed world's population is still increasing. "<br /><br />Right - in the undeveloped world.<br />Economic development:<br />1. reduces population growth rates adn<br />2. increases the efficient use of resources<br /><br />The irony is that, to the extent environmental movements reduce economic development, they worsen environmental impact.<br /><br />But life is full of such ironies.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-39794539541301042342014-04-20T12:34:22.681-04:002014-04-20T12:34:22.681-04:00Mr. Davis asks: "
What would a completely nov...Mr. Davis asks: "<br />What would a completely novel weather pattern look like? Actual cats and dogs falling from the sky?"<br /><br />No, <a href="http://www.wallcoo.net/paint/magritte/images/Magritte_Artwork_ml0001.jpg" rel="nofollow">more like a portrait of the IPCC Summary Committee descending on Brussels.</a>THE CLIMATE WARShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02578106673226403151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-18920171394480793212014-04-20T12:19:43.810-04:002014-04-20T12:19:43.810-04:00Anon. has a point. As that Australian grad student...Anon. has a point. As that Australian grad student cheerfully put it, we probably won't see the tropics rendered uninhabitable to mammals because before we got there civilization would probably collapse, ending significant anthropogenic carbon flux perforce.<br /><br />Things take care of themselves, but not necessarily in the way that you might prefer.afeman (recovering badger)noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-51359054772895541842014-04-20T11:55:46.566-04:002014-04-20T11:55:46.566-04:00Elefritz - if you want to extrapolate ANY trend fa...Elefritz - if you want to extrapolate ANY trend far enough in the future, you can imagine an extreme. NY City streets were once filled with horse manure - imagine at that time extrapolating horse poop with today's population. But people stopped riding horse because they preferred cars.<br /><br />The next degree or two of global warming are probably beneficial to most life forms, including humans.<br /><br />And if you're looking beyond two centuries, you're in ignorance of everything else that will change.<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-2549126564157295892014-04-19T23:18:56.187-04:002014-04-19T23:18:56.187-04:00"Your Honour, members of the jury, the untain..."Your Honour, members of the jury, the untainted historical record clearly shows that forest fires have swept across the surface of the planet, and this country, for millennia; long before our species arrived on the scene, let alone my humble client. And yet the prosecution, and a few activist 'forensic scientists', would have you believe him guilty of arson!..."billnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-14270766526988927532014-04-19T22:15:41.694-04:002014-04-19T22:15:41.694-04:00"Can you name a time in which there was not d..."Can you name a time in which there was not drought somwhere? "<br /><br />That's beyond idiotic. There were murders before therefore there was no Holocaust. <br /><br />What would a completely novel weather pattern look like? Actual cats and dogs falling from the sky?Jeffrey Davishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17966839006518642902noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-70702241452308544582014-04-19T21:17:35.671-04:002014-04-19T21:17:35.671-04:00AT: "Mal - and you believe unsubstantiated ha...AT: "Mal - and you believe unsubstantiated hand-waving about extinction because - why?"<br /><br />Oh, I don't believe unsubstantiated hand-waving. I conditionally accept conclusions that are substantiated by evidence.<br /><br />The evidence is out there, AT. All you have to do is take the necessary basic and advanced courses, read the body of literature, master the methods of research, attend some professional society conferences, publish a few papers, earn the grudging respect of your scientific peers -- you know, the usual grind. How else will you know whether you're fooling yourself or not? <br /><br />Or, if you don't want to put that much time in, you could become at least meta-literate in Science, so you'll know how to tell reliable information from DK-afflicted nonsense. It'll still take some work, but the alternative is having your proud ignorance made fun of on blogs like this one. Mal Adaptedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06123525780458234978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-67475957856089510032014-04-19T20:52:42.799-04:002014-04-19T20:52:42.799-04:00Anonymous says: "There is no plausible extinc...Anonymous says: "<i>There is no plausible extinction case from CO2 in the foreseeable centuries ahead.</i>"<br /><br />In <a href="http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v471/n7336/full/nature09678.html" rel="nofollow">Has the Earth/'s sixth mass extinction already arrived?</a> we find that the rates at which mammals, birds, and reptiles are going extinct today is as fast — and in some cases, much faster — than what led to the five major extinctions in the past. <br /><br />You may wish to also consider <a href="http://eprints.whiterose.ac.uk/83/1/thomascd1.pdf" rel="nofollow">Extinction Risk From Climate Change</a> by Thomas et al, wherein the authors write: "...we predict, on the basis of mid-range climate-warming scenarios for 2050, that 15–37% of species in our sample of regions and taxa will be ‘committed to extinction’."<br /><br />Remember, those numbers are based on warming *only* through 2050. <br /><br />I would say that it's not only plausible - it appears to have already started.<br />Kevin O'Neillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06692943768484857724noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-81683784545828449932014-04-19T20:25:15.816-04:002014-04-19T20:25:15.816-04:00Anonymous says: O'Neill: It looks like this
U...Anonymous says: O'Neill: It looks like <a href="http://populationaction.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/asset_upload_file515_10175.gif%22" rel="nofollow">this</a><br /><br />Ummm ... can you read graphs? The link clearly shows the developed world's population is still increasing. (The dotted line has a little label on it marked 'Today') It is *predicted* to drop by 2050.<br /><br />No defense for your second point? An admission of being wrong would seem in order.<br /><br />Kevin O'Neillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06692943768484857724noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-49242677513278945802014-04-19T20:07:39.547-04:002014-04-19T20:07:39.547-04:00"What could go wrong?"
Religious fundem..."What could go wrong?"<br /><br />Religious fundementalist fucktards - that's what could go wrong. Embedded within governments, institutions and education. Morons with a death wish, hoping for "the end".<br /><br />Humans are very, very stupid. They're incapable of separating themselves from superstitious nonsense and facts. They're also very greedy and ignorant to boot.<br /><br />Ultimately, the combination of ignorance, superstitions, arrogance and greed commit the species to self-extinction.<br /><br />The "evidence" of this fact is found in everything we do.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-69600752620594364652014-04-19T18:27:11.129-04:002014-04-19T18:27:11.129-04:00unsubstantiated hand-waving
AKA - mathematics, ph...<i>unsubstantiated hand-waving</i><br /><br />AKA - mathematics, physics and the geological paleorecord to the deluded anti-science denialist.<br /><br />Who are you trying to fool, grandma? Even grandma ain't that dumb, and she has grandchildren to protect.Thomas Lee Elifritzhttp://cosmic.lifeform.orgnoreply@blogger.com