tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post9179712363597798931..comments2024-03-19T03:14:04.172-04:00Comments on Rabett Run: The APS Rips Hal Lewis Theses DownEliRabetthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07957002964638398767noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-13033940889418184182010-10-16T23:24:30.597-04:002010-10-16T23:24:30.597-04:00Eli, thanks for posting the link to the APS respon...Eli, thanks for posting the link to the APS response. When an acquaintance sent me an email with Lewis's resignation tantrum, I just replied, "This is all baloney. See the APS response," followed by the link to the APS response. Saved me a lot of trouble.<br /><br />John Farley, UNLVAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-6614278232024391562010-10-16T12:29:08.789-04:002010-10-16T12:29:08.789-04:00" The giants no longer walk the earth..."..." The giants no longer walk the earth..."<br /><br />Maybe Lewis is thinking about <a href="http://strangeworldofmystery.blogspot.com/2009/06/giant-skeletons.html" rel="nofollow">stuff like this</a>.Lars Karlssonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06158469980966810882noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-42469682528011862022010-10-16T02:38:36.648-04:002010-10-16T02:38:36.648-04:00There is a very strong penchant in some parts of t...There is a very strong penchant in some parts of the geologic community to poo poo Earth climatic effects of only 1,000 years in duration. This is because once you get to the Silurian or Ordovician, for example, a thousand years is so slim a slice from the clock as to be indiscernible. I would like to hope this is the mindblock that Mr. Lewis is starting from.Douglas Wattshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06686351092076044875noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-64416690403601047962010-10-15T23:53:26.054-04:002010-10-15T23:53:26.054-04:00What did Lewis say and when did he say it?
I'...What did Lewis say and when did he say it?<br /><br />I'm going to focus in one key phrase in the Hal Lewis letter, the APS response, and the Lewis rejoinder to the response.<br /><br />"It is of course, the global warming scam, with the (literally) trillions of dollars driving it, that has corrupted so many scientists, and has carried APS before it like a rogue wave. It is the greatest and most successful pseudoscientific fraud I have seen in my long life as a physicist".<br /><br />Calling it "pseudoscientific" questions the basic underpinnings of climate change science.<br /><br />APS responded:<br />In light of the significant settled aspects of the science, APS totally rejects Dr. Lewis’ claim that global warming is a “scam” and a “pseudoscientific fraud.”<br /><br />And then Lewis (along with Cohen and Happer) say:<br /><br />"What we have here is a bait and switch. No one is saying that the greenhouse effect itself is a scam. This passage seeks to transfer<br />the ‘scam’ charge from its real target to the trivial. The fraud/ scam is to be found in the continual drumbeat that the science is settled; that the effects will be catastrophic; that it requires draconian economic sacrifices to avoid; and that mandates and subsidies for rent-seeking corporations are justified."<br /><br />Read that again. "No one is saying that the greenhouse effect itself is a scam." Does that or does that not endorse the role of CO2 radiation absorption as a climate influence?<br /><br />Lewis and Co. have beaten a hasty retreat to the refuge of uncertainty: while "global warming" is happening due to the greenhouse effect (i.e., CO2 absorption of longwave radiation), the fraud is the claim of "catastrophic global warming" and the socio-political ramifications thereof. Echoing the postulations of Inhofe.<br /><br />SKEPTICS TAKE NOTE: This great response has just endorsed the basic<br />tenets of the scientific community's understanding of global climate<br />change under anthropogenic influence. The present is certain;<br />it is the future that is uncertain.Oakden Wolfhttp://tugpullpushstop.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-29904468535840283152010-10-15T23:30:44.600-04:002010-10-15T23:30:44.600-04:00Hijacking groups for self interested reasons is a ...Hijacking groups for self interested reasons is a long and honorable tradition amongst deniers. The first example I can think of is the American Association of State Climatologists. A largely moribund organization with empty positions, it was taken over by a motley band of deniers seeking what they most crave, legitimacy. Unable to get this through normal means, they have to resort to such subterfuge.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-65329615125273459162010-10-15T08:32:00.785-04:002010-10-15T08:32:00.785-04:00Anonymous asshat, Do you have a point or just an ...Anonymous asshat, Do you have a point or just an attitude? Here's a clue: It's a science blog. Go learn some.a_ray_in_dilbert_spacenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-52507416182832237692010-10-15T07:04:48.228-04:002010-10-15T07:04:48.228-04:00A commenter over at Collide-a-scape had this to sa...<a href="http://www.collide-a-scape.com/2010/10/11/take-a-deep-breath/#comment-21214" rel="nofollow">A commenter</a> over at Collide-a-scape had this to say about 'climate disruption' :<br /><br /><br /><i>Google results for “climate disruption”, 1970 through 2005.<br />over 1000 results<br /><br /><a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=%22climate+disruption%22&hl=en&tbs=cdr:1,cd_min:1/1/1970,cd_max:12/31/2005&prmd=n&ei=DRy2TKuvNMrCnAeX_YXsDw&start=80&sa=N" rel="nofollow">http://www.google.com/search?q=%22climate+disruption%22&hl=en&tbs=cdr:1,cd_min:1/1/1970,cd_max:12/31/2005&prmd=n&ei=DRy2TKuvNMrCnAeX_YXsDw&start=80&sa=N</a></i>JMurphynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-57506577513600462132010-10-15T05:01:04.152-04:002010-10-15T05:01:04.152-04:00Oale:
It's just that Hal Lewis is also, God b...Oale:<br /><br />It's just that Hal Lewis is also, God bless him, clearly a creationist like all good scientists. I'll pray for you.Marion Delgadohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09493068399042656060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-47508227806982964882010-10-15T00:40:06.800-04:002010-10-15T00:40:06.800-04:00> This passes over the fact that carbon dioxide...> This passes over the fact that carbon dioxide absorption lines are nearly <br />> saturated.<br /><br />It's funny what goes for 'fact' nowadays... let's do another peg. Already Svante Arrhenius, using original data from Samuel Langley, showed this to be nonsense... You've had a century to do your homework in mate.Martin Vermeerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04537045395760606324noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-24525879296713976142010-10-14T23:12:11.649-04:002010-10-14T23:12:11.649-04:00Given Lewis' age, it might be there is a cultu...Given Lewis' age, it might be there is a cultural overhang from the post WWII period when many scientists held two mutually exclusive ideas that (a) we are so strong that we can shape the entire world and (b) we are too weak to ever be able to shape the world. Esp. in the geological community this is still the 'debate' about AGW. Yes, even with a nuclear winter or massive global warming or a brutal Ice Age, there would still be microbes clinging to rocks. Nobody denies this. But is that the argument?Douglas Wattshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06686351092076044875noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-19541967495903757712010-10-14T22:46:15.289-04:002010-10-14T22:46:15.289-04:00Come to think of it, I've no knowledge of gian...Come to think of it, I've no knowledge of giant skeletons found anywhere. Maybe there's a story in there.Oalehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14032383453035968859noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-60358026521266402252010-10-14T21:05:29.092-04:002010-10-14T21:05:29.092-04:00Wow...been a while since I was here. But folks act...Wow...been a while since I was here. But folks actually read and believe this POS garbage? Even just a handful I find amazing. Have at it, you in-bred cretins.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-44127769948444266592010-10-14T17:53:07.259-04:002010-10-14T17:53:07.259-04:00Climate dysfunction.Climate dysfunction.David B. Bensonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02917182411282836875noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-86550194930150276552010-10-14T17:17:38.234-04:002010-10-14T17:17:38.234-04:00While I am blase about defense science bureaucrat...While I am blase about defense science bureaucrats "seamlessly' shape shifting to become Climate Wars PR flacks- establishments happen- some of the class acts on the far side of the former iron curtain remain as scary as they were at the Cpld War's height. <br /><br /> Putin's mentors elevated Dezinformatzia to a bureaucratic art form, with the KGB taking its marching orders from Chief Ideologist Boris Ponomare'ev, who could have served as a role model for Boris Badnikov, To make matters lethally worse, Mister Big's pay grade was so high that casual disapproval of the policy ramifications of models could morph into executive action at home or abroad. <br /><br />With this as historical context, what's a little e-mail hacking to a corporate culture forged as part of the apparat of a bone fide totalitarian state? While the APS isn't exactly hardwired to Xe, Putin's oily oligarchy has his former mentors--and their field operatives - on retainer, and they seem eager to please ,since today the threat of violent sanctions [or disappearance a la Alexandrov ] has been replaced by financial incentives.<br /><br />Nostalgia buffs who wish to see some of the most senior talking Cyrillic heads of the Cold War reinventing advertising can see them sharing the stage with characters like Singerat the expense of Lukhoil and sundry Ostie lignite barons. <br /><br />Pace Lubos Motl, they ain't doing it to celebrate free trade in Siberia. Plus ca change.THE CLIMATE WARShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02578106673226403151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-70769601795448932532010-10-14T17:10:38.110-04:002010-10-14T17:10:38.110-04:00Holly is correct that several of the anony-missive...Holly is correct that several of the anony-missives score very high on the <a href="http://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&channel=s&hl=en&source=hp&q=%22What+we+have+here+is+a+bait+and+switch.+No+one+is+saying+that+the+greenhouse+effect+itself+is+a+scam.+This+passage+seeks+to+transfer+the+%E2%80%98scam%E2%80%99+charge+from+its+real+target+to+the+trivial.+%22&btnG=Google+Search" rel="nofollow">plagiarometer</a>.CapitalClimatehttp://capitalclimate.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-37599797944146924832010-10-14T17:07:13.869-04:002010-10-14T17:07:13.869-04:00I always thought his letter read more like 99 fece...I always thought his letter read more like 99 <b>feces</b> than 99 theses.Rattus Norvegicushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03449457204330125792noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-14098692314223991922010-10-14T15:31:00.034-04:002010-10-14T15:31:00.034-04:00That Anon stuff looks lilke it is copied from a po...That Anon stuff looks lilke it is copied from a post at WUWT, here: <br /><br />http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/10/13/aps-responds-deconstructing-the-aps-response-to-dr-hal-lewis-resignation/Holly Stickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01137842937086115228noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-9195488525079228942010-10-14T14:21:04.842-04:002010-10-14T14:21:04.842-04:00Re Eli's "this sort of accusation is very...Re Eli's "this sort of accusation is very prominent from the senior denialists, mostly because that is what they have done and they expect that everyone on the other side is doing just what they did" -<br /><br />The impression I've gotten is that "scientific result for hire" science is how things are (often? formerly?) done, in defense/military-industrial work; which could explain why so many formerly-natl-defense think tanks shifted so seamlessly into the climate denial field.Annahttp://warming101.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-51211051739397434622010-10-14T14:00:15.519-04:002010-10-14T14:00:15.519-04:00Moreover, everyone knows Holdren used "climat...Moreover, everyone knows Holdren used "climate disruption" several years ago already. some have found references to "climate disruption" back to the 1980s!<br /><br />Seems the Rabett had a short WTF-infestation...Marcohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07262670367947223521noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-91084810720174134312010-10-14T13:24:55.235-04:002010-10-14T13:24:55.235-04:00That international banking AND insurance take clim...That international banking AND insurance take climate change seriously is hardly good news for deniers.<br /><br />The "the huge funding machine that diverts billions of taxpayer dollars into research" funds climate research on the order of that spent by Americans on chewing gum.<br /><br />John PumaAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-20958961769325509252010-10-14T12:03:29.000-04:002010-10-14T12:03:29.000-04:00More Anonogarbage. The fact that Lewis and his co...More Anonogarbage. The fact that Lewis and his compadres proposed a Topical Group does not mean that they own it. As Eli wrote to the APS, the danger in forming a Topical Group on Climate is that it would be kidnapped by a fact adverse faction such as happened, to its embarrassment to the UK Institute of Physics. The response of the IOP was to abolish their Topical Group on Energy ASAP. Lewis appears unhappy that his ploy was stomped on. ToughEliRabetthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07957002964638398767noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-17999752745510862172010-10-14T12:01:44.058-04:002010-10-14T12:01:44.058-04:00Who says "climate disruption" is a new e...Who says "climate disruption" is a new expression? <br /><br />I first heard it years ago from a gardening presenter here in Australia. And I agreed with the reasons he gave for preferring it.<br /><br />MinniesMumAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-50151932266061970192010-10-14T12:00:49.657-04:002010-10-14T12:00:49.657-04:00Let Eli, as is goes rip our friend Anonymous down ...Let Eli, as is goes rip our friend Anonymous down a peg.<br /><br />Dwell time means the time between when a pulse of CO2 enters the atmosphere raising the CO2 concentration and the time that the mixing ratio reaches a new equilibrium, hundreds of years, which, Eli notes, will still be higher than what it started at.<br /><br />Anons dishonest bait and switch, refers to the residence time, the time that a particular molecule of CO2 remains in the atmosphere, which is ~5-20 years, maybe a bit less, maybe a bit more depending on exactly how you define it. <a href="http://www.skepticalscience.com/A-residential-lifetime.html" rel="nofollow">Skeptical Science</a> has a discussion of this, but it essentially comes down to CO2 is rapidly distributed between three reservoirs, the atmosphere, the biosphere and the upper ocean. Put a pulse into one of these and it will spread out into the other two in about a decade. However, the long term response is determined by the weather of rocks (10K years) and the transfer into the bottom of the ocean (hundreds of years)<br /><br />It is Anon and his ilks dissembling that makes discussing anything delightful. Take it and shove it.EliRabetthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07957002964638398767noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-22785330621090690782010-10-14T11:33:58.429-04:002010-10-14T11:33:58.429-04:00Lastly, in response to widespread interest express...Lastly, in response to widespread interest expressed by its members, the APS is in the process of organizing a Topical Group to feature forefront research and to encourage exchange of information on the physics of climate.<br /><br />Never mind that the Topical Group was proposed in a petition organized by a group of five members that included Dr. Lewis. Also, the Council has not yet approved a TG; therefore it is not in the process of being “organized.” It is being considered. No formal charter or bylaws have been set down. What we have here is the first attempt to co-opt the TG for PR purposes. This before it has even been approved by the APS Council.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-24816646577824494112010-10-14T11:33:31.152-04:002010-10-14T11:33:31.152-04:00In light of the significant settled aspects of the...In light of the significant settled aspects of the science, APS totally rejects Dr. Lewis’ claim that global warming is a “scam” and a “pseudoscientific fraud.”<br /><br />What we have here is a bait and switch. No one is saying that the greenhouse effect itself is a scam. This passage seeks to transfer the ‘scam’ charge from its real target to the trivial. The fraud/scam is to be found in the continual drumbeat that the science is settled; that the effects will be catastrophic; that it requires draconian economic sacrifices to avoid; and that mandates and subsidies for rent-seeking corporations are justified.<br /><br />Additionally, APS notes that it has taken extraordinary steps to solicit opinions from its membership on climate change. After receiving significant commentary from APS members, the Society’s Panel on Public Affairs finalized an addendum to the APS climate change statement reaffirming the significance of the issue. The APS Council overwhelmingly endorsed the reaffirmation.<br /><br />Never mind that the Panel on Public Affairs is chaired by an individual whose research funding stream (from BP) depends on continued global warming alarm. And you have to keep your eye on the pea. The dispute was not over the “significance” of the issue; it was over the alarmist nature of the statement. The addendum used more than five times the number of words to try to explain what the original statement meant. Not a good sign that they got it right the first time.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com