tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post1909971479370646002..comments2024-03-19T03:14:04.172-04:00Comments on Rabett Run: Over in the comments at Rabett RunEliRabetthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07957002964638398767noreply@blogger.comBlogger176125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-14597181664564986822012-04-21T09:17:31.747-04:002012-04-21T09:17:31.747-04:00~Dr Jay ~PhD sez:
"Getting banned is a sign ...~Dr Jay ~PhD sez:<br /><br />"Getting banned is a sign of intelligence."<br /><br />Now I understand why you've never been banned ...dhogazanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-21305194532857988262012-04-21T09:04:52.913-04:002012-04-21T09:04:52.913-04:00Stop demonizing Maxwell's photonsStop demonizing Maxwell's photonsTHE CLIMATE WARShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02578106673226403151noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-9609955103932601002012-04-19T20:18:17.058-04:002012-04-19T20:18:17.058-04:00As in "Intelligent Design" = "Intel...As in "Intelligent Design" = "Intelligent, de Sun".owlbrudderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14659475201048613993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-25245154053600454942012-04-18T07:19:53.964-04:002012-04-18T07:19:53.964-04:00Eli now awaits the onslaught from the proponents o...Eli now awaits the onslaught from the proponents of Intelligent Photon Theory. Thems little devils know how to avoid being absorbed on a hotter surface.EliRabetthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07957002964638398767noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-24243155932144997602012-04-18T05:04:43.177-04:002012-04-18T05:04:43.177-04:00Well, I have been entertained and educated by the ...Well, I have been entertained and educated by the exchanges here and elsewhere with Andrew Judd. Let me say at once that I have no PhD, but I am older than AJ claims to be, so perhaps I have gained wisdom by osmosis: perhaps not.<br /><br />AJ seems to be obsessed by the meme that the atmosphere does not warm the surface, but forces it to cool more slowly. To quote AJ: "Most of the time the backradiation is helping the surface to cool more slowly". How, exactly, does this 'cool more slowly' take place? I can only assume that AJ considers that the presence of a radiating atmosphere somehow forces surface atoms to delay the emission of their IR photons: that is the only way I can interpret his 'more slowly' claim.<br /><br />Earlier, he said: "The greenhouse effect would carry on working even if the sun stopped producing any energy". Presumably, the greenhouse effect referred to is the afore-mentioned photon emission delay, for which no formula has been offered.<br /><br />He went on to say: "The cold atmosphere can never cause the hotter surface to become warmer unless energy from another source is provided to the surface". Why does it have to be 'another source'? If I have understood the conversation so far:<br /><br /><b>1.</b> A population of photons arrives at the surface from the sun.<br /><br /><b>2.</b> These photons are absorbed by the surface, raising its energy level, which can also be expressed as raising its temperature.<br /><br /><b>3.</b> At its new, elevated temperature, the surface radiates IR photons, thereby cooling the surface.<br /><br /><b>4.</b> Some of the emitted photons are absorbed by the (cooler) atmosphere, thereby increasing the energy level (temperature to dumb bunnies like me).<br /><br /><b>5.</b> The atmosphere emits some of its new energy as photons of IR, but these are emitted in random directions. Approximately half of them are directed back to the surface.<br /><br /><b>6.</b> The atmospheric photons (I know, imprecise terminology, but I am just a dumb bunny) are absorbed by the surface just as readily as the photons from the sun. The surface now has a temperature forced by solar photons plus atmospheric photons (see, I am consistent), so its new temperature is greater than that it would have exhibited if it had only received solar photons.<br /><br />To my higgorant way of thinking, this means the (cooler) atmosphere warms the (hotter) surface, just not as much as the (even hotter) sun.<br /><br />If this simplistic view is close to reality, I can only thank Eli for allowing the conversation to proceed, because I <i>think</i> I have learned something.owlbrudderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14659475201048613993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-59369992654124085482012-04-12T13:41:54.755-04:002012-04-12T13:41:54.755-04:00Dr. Jay Cadbury, phd.
10. Insult the blog owner a...Dr. Jay Cadbury, phd.<br /><br />10. Insult the blog owner and then whine that you got banned. <br /><br />that is the best one. Getting banned is a sign of intelligence.<br /><br />Eli in pure honesty I do think you have a wicked sense of humor.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-83967671468936777152012-04-12T13:38:43.296-04:002012-04-12T13:38:43.296-04:00Dr. Jay Cadbury, phd.
hahahaha, this is actually ...Dr. Jay Cadbury, phd.<br /><br />hahahaha, this is actually hilarious, well done Eli.<br /><br />Can the good doctor get +5pts for at least coming up with his own arguments?<br /><br />I count myself among an elite few who tirelessly demand that we use the entire history of earth's temperature. So I therefore have concluded that because earth is below GAT, we cannot attribute the below average temperatures to human activity because the earth has hit these temperatures already, but naturally.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-79887540271895121472012-04-12T10:56:31.759-04:002012-04-12T10:56:31.759-04:00Andrew,
Radiation is only one mode of heat transfe...Andrew,<br />Radiation is only one mode of heat transfer--and heat transfer is what drives changes in energy content of the system.<br /><br />Heat flowing in warms the system. Heat flowing out cools the system. Get used to it.a_ray_in_dilbert_spacenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-56035196924701212692012-04-12T10:36:21.794-04:002012-04-12T10:36:21.794-04:00I'm just curious about the terms micro and mac...I'm just curious about the terms micro and macro being thrown around a lot lately. Are these the new buzz words. It seems they make it possible to say yes its happening but its not significant. Because of the GHE caused by the GHG CO2 earth is warming. I would consider that macro. Most of us don't care about the GHE caused by low clouds at night.Scroogenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-3406903322905286962012-04-12T10:19:17.117-04:002012-04-12T10:19:17.117-04:00Dilbert
Do you know what net radiation is?
The ...Dilbert<br /><br /><br />Do you know what net radiation is?<br /><br />The net radiation that NASA is measuring is an average amount. When the sun shines upon the surface there is often a net radiation heating, but during the long winter nights there is not.<br /><br />Children can understand these ideas so even you should be able to understand them<br /><br />We dont talk about net radiation between objects like the core, the crust and the mantle of the earth. We talk about conduction <br /><br />The net radiation heating of a pot of boiling water is relatively huge because water vapour carries with it the relatively enormous latent heat of condensation.<br /><br />If you want to talk about children then I can tell you I am 56 and you behave like a very silly little boy. <br /><br />In the real world if you keep on going on about Dunning-Kruger you get a good hiding.<br /><br />Now stop hiding behind the silly name and act like an adultAndrew Juddhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17556323062946182741noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-1859147633991978172012-04-12T09:29:36.348-04:002012-04-12T09:29:36.348-04:00Andrew,
Just curious, but have you ever even known...Andrew,<br />Just curious, but have you ever even known a scientist? We aren't a polite or reserved lot in general. When a colleague reveals himself to be full of a certain brown organic material that is the natural product of metabolizing food, we let him know about it in no uncertain terms. <br /><br />At my age, Andrew, I will exercise my prerogative not to suffer fools gladly. That fool would be you, Andrew.<br /><br />Let us look at the logical knots your position has tied you in. By your contention--since it is only net radiation that can warm--the Sun does not warm the hemisphere experiencing winter. Earth's core cannot warm the mantle, since the mantle is losing just as much energy through the crust. A pot of boiling water is not being warmed from below by the flame, as it is shedding just as much energy in water vapor. And on and on. <br /><br />Your intransigence in this matter is not merely a matter of silliness. It is actually preventing you from understanding the science. You are a Dunning-Kruger poster child.a_ray_in_dilbert_spacenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-74755816414783439162012-04-12T03:56:11.029-04:002012-04-12T03:56:11.029-04:00A rock salt blanket would prevent the arrival of n...A rock salt blanket would prevent the arrival of new cold air, where my body has a small ability to heat large amounts of air but can usefully warm smaller amounts of air - my skin would have a reduced wind chill or draft chill factor.Andrew Juddhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17556323062946182741noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-37450373930215430062012-04-12T03:01:43.070-04:002012-04-12T03:01:43.070-04:00AJ:
"3. A blanket of rock salt will enable me...AJ:<br />"3. A blanket of rock salt will enable me to be warmer."<br /><br />By allowing unimpeded loss of thermal IR ?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-91951834606374165942012-04-12T02:55:02.442-04:002012-04-12T02:55:02.442-04:00It grows clearer with each exchange that Madame Ju...It grows clearer with each exchange that Madame Judd's taste in combat footwear is less at fault than her failure to tie the laces together.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-16790605334514604742012-04-12T01:59:49.367-04:002012-04-12T01:59:49.367-04:00Dilbert
Part of the problem between us, is that y...Dilbert<br /><br />Part of the problem between us, is that you dont think this is a scientific discussion. Therefore most of your answers are abusive, and what you dont say to me you say to the other abusers.<br /><br />A fire warms the surfaces it heats, and the surfaces of your body that are not so heated are cooling.<br /><br />The same reasoning would apply to a terrestial surface which has some cold locations and some warm locations.<br /><br />But in neither case can cold heat hot.<br /><br />You seem unable to realise the importance of distinquishing between microscopic processes and macroscopic processes.Andrew Juddhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17556323062946182741noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-10595207373168094232012-04-11T20:39:22.827-04:002012-04-11T20:39:22.827-04:00Why is anyone still talking to the doorknob? It ca...Why is anyone still talking to the doorknob? It can't hear you.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-10825780232407927492012-04-11T20:24:49.419-04:002012-04-11T20:24:49.419-04:00a_ray_in_dilbert_space,
English may not be his fi...a_ray_in_dilbert_space,<br /><br />English may not be his first language, but thought is definitely not his strong point. I think he failed Abstraction 101.Rattus Norvegicushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03449457204330125792noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-79996798048706893532012-04-11T18:32:27.493-04:002012-04-11T18:32:27.493-04:00OK Mr Judd your last comment has me a bit confused...OK Mr Judd your last comment has me a bit confused. Its almost like you are saying yes but your mother wears combat boots. I hope you don't work at the post office. I was trying to think of something else that would garner a few hundred comments and thought maybe the term ocean acidification might work.Scroogenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-10323274515958403522012-04-11T17:55:30.733-04:002012-04-11T17:55:30.733-04:00Andrew, I can be warmed by a fire and still be los...Andrew, I can be warmed by a fire and still be losing heat. Is English, perhaps, not your first language?a_ray_in_dilbert_spacenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-49430903405535066432012-04-11T15:50:21.614-04:002012-04-11T15:50:21.614-04:00J Bowers: "I'm questioning reality."...J Bowers: "I'm questioning reality."<br /><br />Me, too. Andrew appears to violate SLoT, he's a perpetual bullshit machine!dhogazanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-86440600962205075502012-04-11T13:54:28.103-04:002012-04-11T13:54:28.103-04:00Dilbert
>>I have said all along that backra...Dilbert<br /><br />>>I have said all along that backradiation from the atmosphere warms the surface.<br /><br />Yes. And i keep pointing out that the earth is not flat and heated by a half power sun<br /><br />Most of the time the backradiation is not associated with a warming surface.<br /><br />Most of the time the backradiation is helping the surface to cool more slowly.<br /><br />Which is why I say only an amateur would say the backradiation or the atmosphere warms the surface.<br /><br />The expression is misleading and unhelpful.Andrew Juddhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17556323062946182741noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-35229412504000856632012-04-11T13:21:37.655-04:002012-04-11T13:21:37.655-04:00My head hurts. I'm questioning reality.My head hurts. I'm questioning reality.J Bowersnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-75361192037189490852012-04-11T12:59:09.252-04:002012-04-11T12:59:09.252-04:00Well, congratulations, Andrew. You've achieve...Well, congratulations, Andrew. You've achieved that state coveted by morons where you are incapable of learning anything. Your learning curve has zero slope.<br /><br />I am not saying "the atmosphere warms the surface". I have said all along that backradiation from the atmosphere warms the surface. As said radiation carries energy and is absorbed by the surface, that seems a pretty straightforward corollary to the 1st law of Thermo. <br /><br />You however, refuse to even consider what I am writing and choose to stick your fingers in your ear and say "la-la-la-la". Fine. Stay ignorant.a_ray_in_dilbert_spacenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-52000459999631365902012-04-11T12:20:26.511-04:002012-04-11T12:20:26.511-04:00is you gay or just a drunk?is you gay or just a drunk?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16612221.post-1554661895304673142012-04-11T11:14:41.817-04:002012-04-11T11:14:41.817-04:00Dilbert
Since you have been doing physics for 35 ...Dilbert<br /><br />Since you have been doing physics for 35 years you might have forgotten the earth is not a flat surface heated by a half power sun.<br /><br />The surface temperature is constantly rising and falling.<br /><br />During the day the cold atmosphere is nearly always massively cooling the surface to prevent it becoming massively more hotter.<br /><br />There is no ability of the cold atmosphere to warm the surface without solar energy.<br /><br />Whatever photons arrive from the atmosphere are *massively* outnumbered by photons that heat the atmosphere, where emission is proportional to temperature to the fourth power. <br /><br />Only an amateur is going to say the atmosphere warms the surface in the way you are saying that.Andrew Juddhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17556323062946182741noreply@blogger.com